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Don´t pirate Games Support Jastusa & Mangagamer

Started by kyrt, July 27, 2010, 02:44:05 AM

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kyrt

I will say this I am starting to get pissed off. The game is only 25 fucking dollars and you cannot even support the industry you enjoy so much? Instead you have to steal it from others and hurt the industry in the process.

I hope you know that if you don't actually buy the mother fucking games you won't actually see anymore official releases. Which means in the near future you might not see anything at all with the way the C&Ds are going.

Every once in a while I think you should actually buy a game so that they can make money so that they can release newer and better games. Just a thought.

I would highly recommend not pirating Demonbane. If you have to buy any game it should be this one. Nitroplus will not release anymore games if this does not sell to their satisfaction. Not to mention they've already made it difficult for fan translations. If you ever hope to see another nitroplus title be released for the love of "whatever deity or science you believe" buy the title when it is released and do not pirate it.

I do think this website is very useful for when activations run out, when you need a no cd patch, need japanese games and walkthroughs & translations so the site does have its uses. I won't lie I've downloaded a few myself. I just always see the same people responding and never actually buying. It will come to bite us all in the ass eventually mark my words.

edit: I'm going to leave this here as a reminder that I'm an idiot. For what it is worth I apologize for this post.

Mana

#1

I will say this I am starting to get pissed off. The game is only 25 fucking dollars and you cannot even support the industry you enjoy so much? Instead you have to steal it from others and hurt the industry in the process.

I hope you know that if you don't actually buy the mother fucking games you won't actually see anymore official releases. Which means in the near future you might not see anything at all with the way the C&Ds are going.

Every once in a while I think you should actually buy a game so that they can make money so that they can release newer and better games. Just a thought.

I would highly recommend not pirating Demonbane. If you have to buy any game it should be this one. Nitroplus will not release anymore games if this does not sell to their satisfaction. Not to mention they've already made it difficult for fan translations. If you ever hope to see another nitroplus title be released for the love of "whatever deity or science you believe" buy the title when it is released and do not pirate it.

I do think this website is very useful for when activations run out, when you need a no cd patch, need japanese games and walkthroughs & translations so the site does have its uses. I won't lie I've downloaded a few myself. I just always see the same people responding and never actually buying. It will come to bite us all in the ass eventually mark my words.

If they weren't release here, they would be somewhere else, just like it was before this forum even existed. "The same people" that you always see wouldn't buy the games even if they weren't available somewhere else. It's not the fact that they are available to download that people don't buy it, if you don't believe me, then compare the PS3 console sales to the 360 and Wii. The PS3 still has to be cracked and their sales are lower than those of their competitors. The problem that fan translators have is caused by 2chers who want their superior Japanese games and mangas only for themselves. The same 2chers that download en masse every Western release of an eroge. And if Demonbane fails, it's only JAST's fault for not being able to analyze their market and their customers. They already know the people they are dealing with and how many games are usually bought by them, depending on the type of game. If this is a gamble placed on the people that actually buy games when a fan translation is released, then they could be in for an ugly surprise. If not, then they are confident on their usual customers. We aren't part of the equation. They already know that tens of thousands (ef alone had over 100.000 downloads) will get their games without paying for them, it's the ones that buy that they cater for and that they can depend on.

And before the "that's your excuse for pirating stuff", I don't have any means to afford JAST's and MG's releases, even though I feel bad for it. I'm more worried about getting a job to pay my bills and to treat my health problems, then to pay for games.

laplacian

#2
I'm actually buying games after I played them AND enjoyed them.

But I gotta say those are rare, and most JAST stuff are just utter boring sex games and absolutly not appealing in my eyes ( I mean come on did you really buy stuff like bazooka cafe ? >_> ). I think, the only halfway interesting title they had so far was this game about some family of problem guys/ girls living together, the game which had this controvery going about loli censoring, though I never was interested in playing it. Also Raidy or that car game which seem to be some major JAST hits are totaly unappealing for me, I tried Raidy 1 some time ago and didn't even get through the first 2 lvls, I don't see the point to grind lvls for some porn pics, rather dl some hentai cg pack or h-movie >_<

So yeh, I bought no game from JAST so far, though I bought stuff like Fate/ Stay Night, Sengoku Rance, Aoishiro which were all released by fangroups.
I just don't feel like wasting my money for crap ( I preordered demonbane since it was available though, hoping that it will open the way to Sumaga! ).
Oh and I don't buy mangagamer games out of principle, just like I don't buy any other commercial dl-only games. Gimme a proper package and I'll order Koihime asap T_T!

kyrt

#3
The games may be still be elsewhere even if the this site were gone. I get that piracy is an eternal thing. Hell I'm not even sure most places could do anything about it in the first place if they did do anything at all.

Comparing the PS3 to the 360 and the Wii is fallible. The PS3, despite my owning it, sucks. End of story. It isn't because it can't be cracked it's because it is a bad system. The games suck, the design sucks, and they have more problems than the wii and 360 put together (but not a red ring of death). Bad example of pirating affecting a market.

edit: further evidence that I'm an idiot.

In regards to the 2chers if you ban the ip from japan then you have nothing to worry about. None of these people are actually moving to C&D translations (or whatever it is called). Hopefully we will see more of them begin to do so in the future so that they can remain off the radar. I also believe that they may be some games that are being worked on but we won't be told until finished.

Now mind you many people in this day and age do not have jobs and can barely afford to live let alone buy games. I understand that. However if maybe when (if) the economy ever picks up if you could actually pay for one game would that really be that much to ask? Maybe I'm asking too much. Maybe not.

edit: Despite the rest of this I do agree with this statement that if people ever get out of whatever mess or whatever that they are in that if they actually really enjoy a game that it might not hurt to buy one (let us hope they are cheaper than now though). I'm not telling anyone to actually do this if you want to you can otherwise meh.

Mind you I'm almost positive that both jast and mangagamer know of this site and others similar to it. Whether they do not do anything because it would cost too much, attract unwanted attention, use the site themselves, or believe that this does help on occasion I do not know.

I am not saying that pirating is completely bad. Hell I do it myself (usually not for licensed english titles but that's just me). Pirating is good as well though because the captain has to actually buy the game in order to distribute it to his crew. In some ways it helps in others it hinders.

It helps because some people like laplacian will play games and if they like them they may pay for them if they have money. And it is worth the money.

The good games are hard to find though and it is a reason why pirating is so popular besides the fact it is free. You can't really tell which. It's like try it before you buy it for some people.

I do not believe that MangaYagami is completely correct about all crewmen nor do I believe my original assessment was either. I buy games after all and I pirate so I'm sure there are quite a few who are in the gray area like myself. This along with pirating is how some people get introduced to these type of things both are ways the industry is helped by pirates.

I do believe though that if more Nitroplus titles are to ever be released (they have good games) then at least this once the crews will have to get in bed with the navy-man's daughter in order to get a safe route open for more "honest business"....

just saying.

edit: where the hell was my mind when I typed this. It doesn't even make sense to me and I wrote it.

Green_Tea

uhhh....

You know, if it's a good quality translation, then you know what? I'd buy it. If something like FSN was released officially, then yeah, I'd buy it.

But whatever. Discussion over, you're not gonna change people's minds by ranting ugly, ugly.

Mana

Let me give you the Portuguese example, there are more people with 360s than PS3s here not because people don't like the console itself, but because they can't pirate it's games. In terms of game's sales, both consoles are balanced even though there are more 360 owners over here. I know that this isn't a general rule, but it happens. Regarding the grey area, I have a couple of games and some anime DVDs that I bought when I worked and I would already have stuff from either JAST/MG if I was still working. I won't talk about buying games that were fan translated, because I don't know where I could get them through European stores so that I wouldn't have to deal with the Portuguese customs.

And even though we have to support Demonbane or Higurashi to get more and better stuff, we can't do anything about it. There are people that won't buy it, independently of their finantial situation or how much they liked it. I know a lot of people like that personally and, they don't give a damn. The companies just have to deal with it. There was a pretty good statement made by a Stardock's representative a couple of years ago who stated they saved a lot of money by not implementing copy protections on their titles, which they already knew that someone would eventually break, and that would give problems to eventual customers, so they prefer to invest that money in extended support to their games, which is only accessible to people with authentic serial numbers. I know that already goes beyond the VN market, but the question is that companies can save costs that way while they keep the same prices. The losses they have through piracy are exactly the same, since the games are distributed with the proper cracks. Sometimes, the game will take a week or two longer to have a 100% working crack, but those same people prefer to keep trying new cracks instead of buying the original game. The fact that it's harder to crack doesn't change anything. It's a question of mentality and that person's own morality. You can't change their way of thinking.

laplacian

... so that I wouldn't have to deal with the Portuguese customs. ...

I totaly know what you mean. I had massive problems when I imported Aoishiro. German customs opened the package, like they do with everything fucking package, damn bastards they are, and asked me to visit them and explain what that game is.
I seriously had to met them and we had a discussion about what kind of game that is, and if there are any nude lolis or something in it ( the box is a bit ecchi, nothing much >_> ). Thank god Aoishiro is all ages, I know that drawn nude underage girls are allowed in Germany, but I still got quite uncomfortable during the meeting.

rjrxx

This is just another useless topic. Piracy is as old as the trading relationships and it will not stop.
But since piracy is bad lets check other things:
-2nd hand game commercialization
In console games, whichever they are, we can see an increase market of 2nd hand games, many of them in a really good state.
This is just a response to the economic state of the world vs price of the games.
In consoles like the ps3 this makes much difference because lots of games don't need many playthroughs and are expensive as hell.
Its just buy->resell->buy new one->resell and your game gets to travel around the world. The company gets the money from the 1st buy but nothing besides it and you get some money back from the guy that bought at a lower price. Since the companies don't complain about this market i assume its legal in terms of license ownership.
-Lending games
Another case is lending the game, i care to ask how many of you never lent a game to a friend.
In terms of costs lets see: a 20$ game and you lend it to a friend. Lets say 1000 guys do the same and the company is just burning in 20000$ (and this is just at a small scale)
We don't condemn this act since "we're just loaning to a friend or 2" but the fact it can hurt as much than common piracy, but hey its not on the net it can't hurt much, can it.....

The fact is most of us will try 1st and check the game, some we may like some we may not. And i don't know about many of you guys but i'm sure that i won't buy a game that i hate...
And finally fans will always support the companies. Just check how many fan translation sites are there and you can see that many would close without support (just remembering one that as a monthly fee of 900US$ just for their servers).
If people donate to fan translating groups they can afford to support this games and will to show appreciation for their work.
Piracy is not always bad at least i'm thankful for broadening my horizons in different types of games, especially the japanese visual novels that otherwise i wouldn't know they existed.
Hummm got a bit long... just venting out from all those that think all pirates are bad and will do bad things around the world...

Mana


I totaly know what you mean. I had massive problems when I imported Aoishiro. German customs opened the package, like they do with everything fucking package, damn bastards they are, and asked me to visit them and explain what that game is.

There is that problem, and it's also not illegal around this parts, and the fact that they loved to duplicate the price of the games that I bought from the U.S.. As much as I may like some of those games, paying twice their original price isn't good for anyone's wallet.

Kureha

#9
I'm not going to argue that much, all I can say is that with no job, I'm not qualified to have a credit card. I believe JList also doesn't ship to my country. Then again, everything I'll try to say will probably be excuses. I'm in a dilemma, this is what happens when you live in an Asian country and your first language is English. Problems everywhere.

I live on a budget of 62.3053 USD (excluding utility bills and half the food bills) a month, which is a bit below average even in my country. I keep myself and the server alive with that amount. I gave up buying manga and reading altogether because I just couldn't make ends meet. I'll treat myself to a fig every half a yr or so if I can cough up the cash.

I'm just going to ask that people refrain from making insults, and that we keep the discussion civilized, I'm not one to abuse mod powers and censor those who have different opinions. I'm not saying anyone's not being civilized right now, I'm just saying it in advance incase things turn into a flame war. I should also check about stopping google from crawling the forum pages, incase we appear too much from the keywords lol.
[url="https://ko-fi.com/chi_chan"]
[/url]

godgrinder

#10
i spend most of my money on music and i buy anime dvds from time to time, but i'm not too interested in buying games because...

1. i probably won't play them again anyway;
2. if i have to spend $100 (what most japanese galgames would cost) or 50 euros (what most mangagamer titles would cost) on one item i'd rather go and get a rare vinyl record off ebay, it would makes me much happier than buying some game.
我哋經已失去太多興趣 我哋經已失去太多伴侶

Mana

@Kureha: I can write long-winded posts and/or be quite arrogant while I RAGE, but if I see that I'm going to make a fool of myself, more than I usually am, then I stop writing. If a person firmly believes on their own opinion, it isn't a reason to insult someone else, even if their argument is the opposite, flawed or inconsistent.

@godgrinder: That's how I act regarding movies and, most people have their priorities related to what they enjoy and what they actually buy. There was even the case of a renowned Portuguese football player who got caught by the police with dozens of copied DVD movies and it wasn't because he didn't have the money to buy them, lol.

Green_Tea

I still think he's just trolling.

No one seriously give a shit about piracy and no one would be stupid enough to voice out a non-valid opinion on this site which is crawling with it. Meh, boring.

On the other hand-

No that would be stealing another thread. I shall return to my own.

arcanis

Well, here are my 2 cents.
Recently there was great sale on steam. So let's compare games and prices during that sale.
Lets take top games:
Civilization IV (3 addons included) - 10$ (regular price 20$)
Dragon Age - 15$ (regular price 30$)
And what about casual games?
Plants vs Zombies - 8$ (regular price 10$)
Shatter - 5$ (regular price 10$)
And after that MangaGamer wants 26$ for, say, Cosplay Alien and 48$ for KiraKira? That make me laugh, really. I mean "Hey, guys? In what universe do you live?"

X-Japan

Digital only downloads without any packaging or disc for $25 is a rip off. I really enjoyed playing through Higurashi, but its a waste if you get no value for your money and there's a free cracked version on this website (which BTW I delete as soon as I am finished reading it).

And if these companies lose money and stop translating games? Heck if I care. I won't be taken for an idiot. I'd just focus my attention to other games. And anyways, I doubt that these downloads hurt sales at all. If that's true, how was Mangagamer able to release all 8 games so quickly? You can't do this unless you had good sales and expected a good return on the investment.

And another point: years ago, illegal downloading of music was said to be the nail in the coffin for the music industry. Eminem's newest album came out a few weeks ago and it sold millions.